Divulging Names & Teams/Pacts/Cliques

MoogMoog Posts: 481 ✭✭✭✭
Hello Hutch
I know it's been raised before, and I'm sure it's not a 2 min fix, but could you please clarify if you're working on not having my name visible in game for others to find on Facebook.

There are two issues that I have:
Firstly, it's being contacted by random people for the game. Every time I stray into a top10, I seem to get messages, it's even happening for ceramics now. This last bunch were nice and polite, but in the past, when I've refused I've had abuse. I was also contacted once by someone I'd raced against, not for a pact, but so he could hurl abuse at me for beating him.

Secondly, there's the issues of cliques. If you're in a bracket and you get too close to the top and there is a team there, you have the option of join them or miss out. I have joined in the past to be fair, and I was instructed who to target and so on.
This sort of behaviour means that I either need to spend half my weekend finding the right clique to join and joining in with their bullying or settle for T2.

I don't think either of these issues help move Top Drives forward or make it an inclusive game to play. 


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Comments

  • nathanwindnathanwind Posts: 360 ✭✭✭
    edited June 22
    I experienced this truly for the first time this weekend. 9 of the top 10 were in collusion and it had everything described above. Win feeding. Facebook stalking. Shielding players. The whole 9 yards. Now this time I was a beneficiary of it but it doesn't sit right. I was reluctant to go down the Facebook route of saved progress but once my garage reached a certain size I made a pact with the devil and ever since then I've had the messages etc. @David_Fook is right on the money. Take one of the tools of this nefarious practice away straight away.
  • 0171801718 Posts: 498 ✭✭✭
    Hi,

    while I totally agree with the posts intention, I would like to make an additional proposal:

    Would it be a good idea if the community of this forum establises some kind of codex or etiquette which behaviour regarding teaming is acceptable and what is too much?

    I also wouldn't mind a topic to point this kind of behaviour out, just like the "bad smurfers" topic.

    It's just an idea, I'm happy to discard it if it is bad.
  • Hutch_DmitriHutch_Dmitri Posts: 178 admin
    edited June 22
    Hey, I think the first point you are bringing up is important, we've had several people requesting to hide their name from the game, however right now the only way to do it is by unlinking your facebook account, which can only be done by Hutch team on an individual basis. I am not sure whether it is technically possible to hide your name, but I suspect that any solution would require quite a lot of development work which won't be a priority. But I'll pass the feedback for sure.

    Regarding players teaming up, this is one is tricky, I have talked to the team about this previously and while we appreciate that players may feel unfair that someone is teaming up against them, it is a part of the game and therefore it cannot be fully prohibited. At the moment, we don't have reasonable possible solutions available to us. We considered, as some users suggested, to force players to only race against specific positions (above or below them) after an X amount of races, however we realised it wouldn't make any substantial difference.
  • MoogMoog Posts: 481 ✭✭✭✭
    Hey, I think the first point you are bringing up is important, we've had several people requesting to hide their name from the game, however right now the only way to do it is by unlinking your facebook account, which can only be done by Hutch team on an individual basis. I am not sure whether it is technically possible to hide your name, but I suspect that any solution would require quite a lot of development work which won't be a priority. But I'll pass the feedback for sure.

    Regarding players teaming up, this is one is tricky, I have talked to the team about this previously and while we appreciate that players may feel unfair that someone is teaming up against them, it is a part of the game and therefore it cannot be fully prohibited. At the moment, we don't have reasonable possible solutions available to us. We considered, as some users, to force players to only race against specific positions (above or below them) after an X amount of races, however we realised it wouldn't make any substantial difference.
    Thanks for the reply Dmitri.
    Regarding unlinking my Facebook account, would this mean that I'd lose the cloudsave feature? I currently play on two devices so I currently make use of that feature.

    Prohibiting team play could be done by removing all information about other players. If I could only see my name on the top list, no TD numbers, avatars or anything then it really would be solo play. I appreciate that wouldn't suit everyone though, it would probably need separate brackets for teamsters vs solo.
  • Hutch_DmitriHutch_Dmitri Posts: 178 admin
    Moog said:
    Hey, I think the first point you are bringing up is important, we've had several people requesting to hide their name from the game, however right now the only way to do it is by unlinking your facebook account, which can only be done by Hutch team on an individual basis. I am not sure whether it is technically possible to hide your name, but I suspect that any solution would require quite a lot of development work which won't be a priority. But I'll pass the feedback for sure.

    Regarding players teaming up, this is one is tricky, I have talked to the team about this previously and while we appreciate that players may feel unfair that someone is teaming up against them, it is a part of the game and therefore it cannot be fully prohibited. At the moment, we don't have reasonable possible solutions available to us. We considered, as some users, to force players to only race against specific positions (above or below them) after an X amount of races, however we realised it wouldn't make any substantial difference.
    Thanks for the reply Dmitri.
    Regarding unlinking my Facebook account, would this mean that I'd lose the cloudsave feature? I currently play on two devices so I currently make use of that feature.

    Prohibiting team play could be done by removing all information about other players. If I could only see my name on the top list, no TD numbers, avatars or anything then it really would be solo play. I appreciate that wouldn't suit everyone though, it would probably need separate brackets for teamsters vs solo.
    Yes, sadly you will lose cloudsaving feature if we unlink your account.
  • Hutch_DmitriHutch_Dmitri Posts: 178 admin
    Hey, I think the first point you are bringing up is important, we've had several people requesting to hide their name from the game, however right now the only way to do it is by unlinking your facebook account, which can only be done by Hutch team on an individual basis. I am not sure whether it is technically possible to hide your name, but I suspect that any solution would require quite a lot of development work which won't be a priority. But I'll pass the feedback for sure.

    Regarding players teaming up, this is one is tricky, I have talked to the team about this previously and while we appreciate that players may feel unfair that someone is teaming up against them, it is a part of the game and therefore it cannot be fully prohibited. At the moment, we don't have reasonable possible solutions available to us. We considered, as some users suggested, to force players to only race against specific positions (above or below them) after an X amount of races, however we realised it wouldn't make any substantial difference.
    How could adding a field for nickname entry in options and switching a link to a resource in event board view could possibly constitute a lot of development

    Asking as a dev
    I will enquire about this further this week, not sure how much dev work it would require but my assumption is that other essential dev work will take priority. This may be considered a quality of life improvement which will have lower priority against other things. 

    I think there are multiple other considerations to this, but I need to speak to the team before I could say more.
  • REALAISREALAIS Posts: 904 ✭✭✭✭
    Moog said:
    Hey, I think the first point you are bringing up is important, we've had several people requesting to hide their name from the game, however right now the only way to do it is by unlinking your facebook account, which can only be done by Hutch team on an individual basis. I am not sure whether it is technically possible to hide your name, but I suspect that any solution would require quite a lot of development work which won't be a priority. But I'll pass the feedback for sure.

    Regarding players teaming up, this is one is tricky, I have talked to the team about this previously and while we appreciate that players may feel unfair that someone is teaming up against them, it is a part of the game and therefore it cannot be fully prohibited. At the moment, we don't have reasonable possible solutions available to us. We considered, as some users, to force players to only race against specific positions (above or below them) after an X amount of races, however we realised it wouldn't make any substantial difference.
    Thanks for the reply Dmitri.
    Regarding unlinking my Facebook account, would this mean that I'd lose the cloudsave feature? I currently play on two devices so I currently make use of that feature.

    Prohibiting team play could be done by removing all information about other players. If I could only see my name on the top list, no TD numbers, avatars or anything then it really would be solo play. I appreciate that wouldn't suit everyone though, it would probably need separate brackets for teamsters vs solo.
    If you are using iOs devices then yeah. But if you usr Android with linked Google Play profile, it saves everything without need of facebook.
  • BoxtaSBoxtaS Posts: 1,893 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Surely it must be possible to just display TD number in the leaderboards rather than Facebook name? 

    That would of course make it slightly harder to identify friends, but I think I could live with that. 
  • evilprofesseurevilprofesseur Posts: 1,841 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 22
    Hey, I think the first point you are bringing up is important, we've had several people requesting to hide their name from the game, however right now the only way to do it is by unlinking your facebook account, which can only be done by Hutch team on an individual basis. I am not sure whether it is technically possible to hide your name, but I suspect that any solution would require quite a lot of development work which won't be a priority. But I'll pass the feedback for sure.

    Regarding players teaming up, this is one is tricky, I have talked to the team about this previously and while we appreciate that players may feel unfair that someone is teaming up against them, it is a part of the game and therefore it cannot be fully prohibited. At the moment, we don't have reasonable possible solutions available to us. We considered, as some users suggested, to force players to only race against specific positions (above or below them) after an X amount of races, however we realised it wouldn't make any substantial difference.
    How could adding a field for nickname entry in options and switching a link to a resource in event board view could possibly constitute a lot of development

    Asking as a dev
     having thought about this for a bit longer I admit there's also a matter of storing the data somewhere and possibly addressing the issue of the avatar so there's more work to be done, it's not as trivial. Basic functionality is easy to achieve though.
  • TD42792TD42792 Posts: 2,264 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ozzman said:
    Displaying a name and profile pic chosen by us instead of our FB name/pic, and eliminating gatekeeping (win-feeding by quit-loss) as Mr Fook proposed would be a great start, and I seriously doubt it should be too much work for the developers.
    You can still win-feed without quit-loss, no? Just use weaker cars or misplace them.
    This is the biggest pb imo but I do not see how it can be avoided without a complete revamp of the competition system. As long as players can identify each other you will always be able to win-feed.
    People are exploiting this big time. Bigger issue than late joining imo.
  • 0liver770liver77 Posts: 357 ✭✭✭
    REALAIS said:
    Moog said:
    Hey, I think the first point you are bringing up is important, we've had several people requesting to hide their name from the game, however right now the only way to do it is by unlinking your facebook account, which can only be done by Hutch team on an individual basis. I am not sure whether it is technically possible to hide your name, but I suspect that any solution would require quite a lot of development work which won't be a priority. But I'll pass the feedback for sure.

    Regarding players teaming up, this is one is tricky, I have talked to the team about this previously and while we appreciate that players may feel unfair that someone is teaming up against them, it is a part of the game and therefore it cannot be fully prohibited. At the moment, we don't have reasonable possible solutions available to us. We considered, as some users, to force players to only race against specific positions (above or below them) after an X amount of races, however we realised it wouldn't make any substantial difference.
    Thanks for the reply Dmitri.
    Regarding unlinking my Facebook account, would this mean that I'd lose the cloudsave feature? I currently play on two devices so I currently make use of that feature.

    Prohibiting team play could be done by removing all information about other players. If I could only see my name on the top list, no TD numbers, avatars or anything then it really would be solo play. I appreciate that wouldn't suit everyone though, it would probably need separate brackets for teamsters vs solo.
    If you are using iOs devices then yeah. But if you usr Android with linked Google Play profile, it saves everything without need of facebook.
    I tried this months ago. Then it's not the Facebook Name shown, then everyone sees your Googleplay Name, which is my real Name. On Facebook I use a Fake Name. But I would Like to know how to Change my Googleplay name into a Fake Name.
  • OzzmanOzzman Posts: 1,814 ✭✭✭✭✭
    TD42792 said:
    Ozzman said:
    Displaying a name and profile pic chosen by us instead of our FB name/pic, and eliminating gatekeeping (win-feeding by quit-loss) as Mr Fook proposed would be a great start, and I seriously doubt it should be too much work for the developers.
    You can still win-feed without quit-loss, no? Just use weaker cars or misplace them.
    This is the biggest pb imo but I do not see how it can be avoided without a complete revamp of the competition system. As long as players can identify each other you will always be able to win-feed.
    People are exploiting this big time. Bigger issue than late joining imo.
    You're right, but it would at least make gatekeeping a bit less straightforward. But as soon as FB stalking is gone, team-play wouldn't be such a big issue. I think it's new groups forming for every event that's causing the main problem here. I'm saying this as somebody who won the LC2 as part of such group.
  • 0liver770liver77 Posts: 357 ✭✭✭
    Moog said:
    Hello Hutch
    I know it's been raised before, and I'm sure it's not a 2 min fix, but could you please clarify if you're working on not having my name visible in game for others to find on Facebook.

    There are two issues that I have:
    Firstly, it's being contacted by random people for the game. Every time I stray into a top10, I seem to get messages, it's even happening for ceramics now. This last bunch were nice and polite, but in the past, when I've refused I've had abuse. I was also contacted once by someone I'd raced against, not for a pact, but so he could hurl abuse at me for beating him.

    Secondly, there's the issues of cliques. If you're in a bracket and you get too close to the top and there is a team there, you have the option of join them or miss out. I have joined in the past to be fair, and I was instructed who to target and so on.
    This sort of behaviour means that I either need to spend half my weekend finding the right clique to join and joining in with their bullying or settle for T2.

    I don't think either of these issues help move Top Drives forward or make it an inclusive game to play. 


    I've created a Facebook Account Just for Games. beside Topdrives I use it for two other Games. 
    And I never Log in to Check Messages. There might be tousands unread ;-)
  • OzzmanOzzman Posts: 1,814 ✭✭✭✭✭
     having thought about this for a bit longer I admit there's also a matter of storing the data somewhere and possibly addressing the issue of the avatar so there's more work to be done, it's not as trivial. Basic functionality is easy to achieve though.
    Right, it might get tricky, but profile pics could be just a few pre-defined pictures of which you can choose, or just get rid of profile pics altogether, name is enough. Surely storing a custom name for all accounts shoudn't be a problem.

    0liver77 said:
    I've created a Facebook Account Just for Games. beside Topdrives I use it for two other Games. 
    And I never Log in to Check Messages. There might be tousands unread ;-)
    Isn't there a risk of FB deleting such (fake looking) accounts?
  • MoogMoog Posts: 481 ✭✭✭✭
    0liver77 said:
    I've created a Facebook Account Just for Games. beside Topdrives I use it for two other Games. 
    And I never Log in to Check Messages. There might be tousands unread ;-)
    Thanks, good idea. I think it's against Facebook's T&Cs to have a second account though?
  • David_FookDavid_Fook Posts: 2,760 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ozzman said:
    TD42792 said:
    Ozzman said:
    Displaying a name and profile pic chosen by us instead of our FB name/pic, and eliminating gatekeeping (win-feeding by quit-loss) as Mr Fook proposed would be a great start, and I seriously doubt it should be too much work for the developers.
    You can still win-feed without quit-loss, no? Just use weaker cars or misplace them.
    This is the biggest pb imo but I do not see how it can be avoided without a complete revamp of the competition system. As long as players can identify each other you will always be able to win-feed.
    People are exploiting this big time. Bigger issue than late joining imo.
    You're right, but it would at least make gatekeeping a bit less straightforward. But as soon as FB stalking is gone, team-play wouldn't be such a big issue. I think it's new groups forming for every event that's causing the main problem here. I'm saying this as somebody who won the LC2 as part of such group.
    It would still be possible to lose, but this awards fewer points to the winner, and takes more time. I’ve also seen gatekeeping where the keeper couldn’t lose to the keepee even if he tried. All UR hands sitting first with all legend hands 10th would be gone. Or course the keeper could put out a poor hand to feed but then he’d be much more vulnerable 
  • REALAISREALAIS Posts: 904 ✭✭✭✭
    0liver77 said:
    REALAIS said:
    Moog said:
    Hey, I think the first point you are bringing up is important, we've had several people requesting to hide their name from the game, however right now the only way to do it is by unlinking your facebook account, which can only be done by Hutch team on an individual basis. I am not sure whether it is technically possible to hide your name, but I suspect that any solution would require quite a lot of development work which won't be a priority. But I'll pass the feedback for sure.

    Regarding players teaming up, this is one is tricky, I have talked to the team about this previously and while we appreciate that players may feel unfair that someone is teaming up against them, it is a part of the game and therefore it cannot be fully prohibited. At the moment, we don't have reasonable possible solutions available to us. We considered, as some users, to force players to only race against specific positions (above or below them) after an X amount of races, however we realised it wouldn't make any substantial difference.
    Thanks for the reply Dmitri.
    Regarding unlinking my Facebook account, would this mean that I'd lose the cloudsave feature? I currently play on two devices so I currently make use of that feature.

    Prohibiting team play could be done by removing all information about other players. If I could only see my name on the top list, no TD numbers, avatars or anything then it really would be solo play. I appreciate that wouldn't suit everyone though, it would probably need separate brackets for teamsters vs solo.
    If you are using iOs devices then yeah. But if you usr Android with linked Google Play profile, it saves everything without need of facebook.
    I tried this months ago. Then it's not the Facebook Name shown, then everyone sees your Googleplay Name, which is my real Name. On Facebook I use a Fake Name. But I would Like to know how to Change my Googleplay name into a Fake Name.
    Google Play profile is Gmail account. 
  • MrpiratepeteMrpiratepete Posts: 968 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I will enquire about this further this week, not sure how much dev work it would require but my assumption is that other essential dev work will take priority. This may be considered a quality of life improvement which will have lower priority against other things. 
    Yes, but this "quality of life improvement" has been raised multiple times for over 1 year now. Will it always just be low priority? 
    Win Feeding and Gate-Keeping are huge problems that become bigger and bigger. I like Fooks idea, opponents should't get points when you quit races. 
  • MoogMoog Posts: 481 ✭✭✭✭
    Not wanted to get all legal and s#*t, but is it a GDPR issue?
  • Yama_sanYama_san Posts: 346 ✭✭✭
    Btw do you guys experience the same curious thing than me: sometimes it shows my TD number in the list, sometimes my FB name. Seems quite random.

    While I also support the suggestions of this thread, I would also suggest to use another FB account for everything which is not personal on the web (games, etc.).
  • 0171801718 Posts: 498 ✭✭✭
    Ozzman said:
     having thought about this for a bit longer I admit there's also a matter of storing the data somewhere and possibly addressing the issue of the avatar so there's more work to be done, it's not as trivial. Basic functionality is easy to achieve though.
    Right, it might get tricky, but profile pics could be just a few pre-defined pictures of which you can choose, or just get rid of profile pics altogether, name is enough. Surely storing a custom name for all accounts shoudn't be a problem.


     
    Every user already has a name, not a custom one, tho. It is the TopDrives#####. I wonder how it is possivle for TO to do that with just 5 digits so far, should be more than 100k individuals...

    However, wouldn't it be the easiest way to implement some kind of chosen pseudonymity, if we could just check a box to display our name like no facebook or google account was connected to it?

  • AndreasSimmerAndreasSimmer Posts: 1,927 ✭✭✭✭✭
    @01718 TD numbers are given out several times, and yes, a simple option to choose a name wold already help, still disconnecting names from FB at all the best move.
  • bertmcfishbertmcfish Posts: 229 ✭✭✭
    Moog said:
    Not wanted to get all legal and s#*t, but is it a GDPR issue?
    It is most definitely a legal issue - Hutch are displaying pii and allowing people to be identified. It is illegal 
  • xaratsarhsxaratsarhs Posts: 381 ✭✭✭
    Ok, I found out about this forum , while I was using only in game forum because of someone that rule me out from t1.
    Even though I had better hand than his friend, last minute he feed him so much he could overtake me. I msg the guy to congrats him about this strategy, (it was just a ceramic). I had never seen anything like this before. He told me that I gave a good fight but the other guy was a forum member and invited me to follow this forum. Lots of cooperations started here ever since.
    Its a little bit hypocrite to raise an issue about cooping through Fb, discord or what ever, when this all started here.
    I never saw cooping discussions on in game forum anyway.
    So ether nickname or fb name, cooping will exist, its part of the game that won't change.
    Abusing and bulling are other issues related with social platforms with or without TD game.
    This abusing msgs would have the same impact if they where here or anywhere else.
    Just my opinion.

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