we want more events, more requirements, cooperation, etc. - yes. But clubs are not about it at all. Zero cooperation. How can I cooperate with 100+ people? There are no cooperation in just racing enemies.
Exactly - we wanted more events; not replacing old events. The dailies can stay and you can still add new modes.
As part of the overall objection to smurfing, part of the question is how much value should you get for quite a low effort strategy that involves playing in a way that wasn't intended. What should determine the cash players earn each week in these lower stakes events?
Just a quick look at Blue2moro's numbers. I'll propose a few corrections, perhaps there are more.
- 224k a week is assuming 7 fewer events, but there are only 6 fewer events due to an additional Thursday event, so that's 192k difference. Tier 4 of a 48h event rewards 2.5k extra cash more than Tier 4 of a 24h event, so lets say 189.5k cash. - If you assume at least Rookie rank, as it takes just two days to get to, that adds $1.5k (1k event, 0.5k season) - Spend 499 gold on the doubler, and you're at -59 gold, but up 129.5k.
There may be more maths we can do, and we'll keep an eye on the actual earnings, but then we're talking about 259k a week. That's +35k and -59 gold. Much closer than it sounded with the example you gave.
@Hutch_Robin thank you for your response. My response in bold below.
I've spoken about this before. Totally missed that. I don't read the forum every day. Here are ten of our reasons: - Players wanted more ways to play Top Drives, rather than the limited ticket system. Club Events especially serves time rich players. Some players voiced that in the past, yes. Not by removing the daily events. Club events does indeed serve the time rich players, not the time poor players, the ones with jobs, school etc. The daily serves the time limited players. So, are you focusing on the time rich players? - Players wanted shorter, quickfire events Indeed, but as an addition to the current structure and not with the removal of daily events. - Players wanted more variety in events, in terms of track sets and restrictions, and we needed a way to scale this. Similarly, players just wanted to use more of their garages. Players complained about the lack of variety (and other issues) in Daily Events a lot. You are right that people complained about the variety. And the solution could have been more variety in the daily events and not the same events every week. Players voiced that over and over again for months. The complains were about that, not that they wanted the removal of the daily events. - Players liked the idea of choice in which events they joined. It potentially allows players to specialise their garage more effectively. Players can decide to enter the daily or not. More variety in daily events will allow players to use their garage more effectively. - Daily Events were not just too similar but players played against the same players so often. We wanted to try a social feature where lots of different players could encounter one another outside of the forums. I play with the same players in regular events all the time. I have seen the same people in my bracket winning prize cars week after week. Are you removing those also? Not sure what this has to do with daily events unless you are talking about all events. The social aspect is great, as an addition and only as that. If i don't want to socialize, you are leaving me with no choice but to do so? - The losing to win farming strategy was not particular fun, but felt necessary. Ultimately, it wasn't good for the game It was great for the game. Ask anyone who farmed and got ceramics. And if someone didn't like it, they had the choice of not entering. - We wanted to find a way to introduce less timezone sensitive events Perfect. Good for the club events, why was the daily event removed? The rest of the events will still be time sensitive right? - I had seen the territory mechanic in other games and it was compelling There are a lot of other compelling mechanics in other games. Daily events got removed because other games have different mechanics? - We observed players enjoying working together in events, and wanted to introduce light cooperation in events so that that experience was available to more users We love having virtual friends, Myspace has the idea first i think and Facebook stole it. The reason players coop is because of the great prizes. Daily events could become coop too. If the prizes were better. I'm not going to coop to win that great aluminium pack. - We wanted to introduce something fresh. Perhaps a trial for player created clubs in the future. Players had also requested us doing something in the club space. This was a way to have a simple implementation of clubs, without too much infrastructure around setting up and maintaining a club, allowing us to focus on a twist on the standard event gameplay. Club Events is also a new framework to build on. Fresh is good, and club events are ok. Good thoughts on how the clubs can become better over time. Also don't fix it until is broken is also good thing. The reasons you provided give absolutely no indication in my mind that daily events weren't working. If you want to call it top 10 reasons why we are introducing Club events, i'm with you. Just don't call it 10 reasons why you are removing daily events. Daily events can and should stay. Ultimately, it is up to the player to enter the daily or not. Players have a choice.
@Hutch_Robin Please please please don't get rid of the dailies. At least not without thinking very seriously about their impact and the prizes for club participation.
Cash is BEYOND important to F2P. Consistent, reliable cash generation is the only reason F2P is viable.
Even a freshly minted rq150 player can smurf effectively and make significant funds from the dailies.
The numbers above suggest that even the best players with the widest garages will see revenue from dailies halved by their replacement with club events. Someone with a thin garage will see their earning potential drop significantly further.
Anything that compromises the ability to earn cash compromises the ability of f2p players to compete, the three ceramics a day I can open are the source of the bulk of epics, legends and food for the same that I've been able to muster in 18 months of play.
For newer players they are even more critical.
The dailies are also an interesting exercise in revenue maximising, less like a competition, more like a puzzle, no less interesting because of that and no worse for having a repeatable "solution".
I'd be content enough of they changed once a quarter, but honestly you could leave them alone for the life of the game and that would be fine by me.
If you insist on getting rid of the dalies then I suggest you need to double the number of regular events running or dramatically increase the club rewards either with packs or cash so 5 tickets every 2.5 hours generates a similar return to participation in the daily over the long term.
I do wonder however if cash rewards are the best motivator to get people playing the club events. Having good packs at the end of each week or something might be a better motivator to bring people in. 5x ceramics or a carbon or garage slots would be more motivating to me than any cash reward.
If not weekly perhaps top tier prizes could be unlocked by club achievements. Every 100 MVP awards you get 25 garage slots. Every 25 top 10 finishes earns a Ceramic pack. 100 platinum for participation? Have a CF. 500 events with at least 5 races run? ceramic + slots. The constant ticking over of good rewards (some behind a significant grind) would really drag people in IMHO.
I don't discount the possibility that this is just resistance to change, but I really struggle with why the introduction of clubs (compelling concept, very welcome, needs work) means the end of the daily? I don't see the cost to the player base or indeed to hutch of continuing to run the dalies.
There’s a beautiful irony about the claim to boost cooperation. There was 10x the player cooperation in successful smurfing than there ever will be in clubs. It was a bunch of players figuring out a way to all cooperate and reap some rewards together. Let it live.
As part of the overall objection to smurfing, part of the question is how much value should you get for quite a low effort strategy that involves playing in a way that wasn't intended. What should determine the cash players earn each week in these lower stakes events?
Just a quick look at Blue2moro's numbers. I'll propose a few corrections, perhaps there are more.
- 224k a week is assuming 7 fewer events, but there are only 6 fewer events due to an additional Thursday event, so that's 192k difference. Tier 4 of a 48h event rewards 2.5k extra cash more than Tier 4 of a 24h event, so lets say 189.5k cash. - If you assume at least Rookie rank, as it takes just two days to get to, that adds $1.5k (1k event, 0.5k season) - Spend 499 gold on the doubler, and you're at -59 gold, but up 129.5k.
There may be more maths we can do, and we'll keep an eye on the actual earnings, but then we're talking about 259k a week. That's +35k and -59 gold. Much closer than it sounded with the example you gave.
Same events whole day - Waaaay more boring than dailies.
I understand a lot of your objections, but come on. There is more variety in Club Events than Dailies.
Do you take into consideration that before in order to earn the amount of cash and gold you could login once every 2.5hr, play and go, now you have to be online about +8hr just to earn the cash for a ceramic, not to mention the take away of daily ceramic/aluminium/plastic packs and the gold, then you suggest to spend gold on the doubler? That's like using gold to buy just a bit more of cash, for what?
They say don't fix something that's not broken, but you are taking the daily away because the lowest part of f2p aren't satisfied with the usual players always winning it? Well, who do you think will ever spend 499 gold on a doubler? Certainly not the no spending players, and let's be frank, nobody unless somebody with super fat finger to click it twice by mistake.
You know what they really want? To have the trophy count taken away or the trophy deficit to be back so they feel free to smurf, which you could counter by setting a barometer on each person's garage strength, but that's past, and what's people complaining isn't what the club is resolving.
Sorry to say but the long waited club has turned out to be a very big disappointment for the long term players, I don't even know how it stands as the idea, when you could just have taken even a little inspiration from other games with group play, like super cell's games, or animation throwndown (Kongregate) who makes a lot of profit with their card game by setting "guilds" to fight one another, to compete with a specific set of collection each week. Instead you use this territory thing with seasons, why? What benefit does it bring you? Does it sell more packs for you?
I don't care if you take this comment down because you don't like my opinion, but I have to spill it since I've witnessed this game "falling" in such short time (2 years life is not long). Hope you don't have to eat your own words from the results that you are going to see later.
There’s a beautiful irony about the claim to boost cooperation. There was 10x the player cooperation in successful smurfing than there ever will be in clubs. It was a bunch of players figuring out a way to all cooperate and reap some rewards together. Let it live.
agreed. smurfing cant be done alone, wonderfull cooperation. while in the clubmode i feel alone, even if im in one bracket with guys i know. I never see their hands, and everything is over before you can even try a tactic or communicate.
@Hutch_Robin Please please please don't get rid of the dailies. At least not without thinking very seriously about their impact and the prizes for club participation.
Cash is BEYOND important to F2P. Consistent, reliable cash generation is the only reason F2P is viable.
Even a freshly minted rq150 player can smurf effectively and make significant funds from the dailies.
The numbers above suggest that even the best players with the widest garages will see revenue from dailies halved by their replacement with club events. Someone with a thin garage will see their earning potential drop significantly further.
Anything that compromises the ability to earn cash compromises the ability of f2p players to compete, the three ceramics a day I can open are the source of the bulk of epics, legends and food for the same that I've been able to muster in 18 months of play.
For newer players they are even more critical.
The dailies are also an interesting exercise in revenue maximising, less like a competition, more like a puzzle, no less interesting because of that and no worse for having a repeatable "solution".
I'd be content enough of they changed once a quarter, but honestly you could leave them alone for the life of the game and that would be fine by me.
If you insist on getting rid of the dalies then I suggest you need to double the number of regular events running or dramatically increase the club rewards either with packs or cash so 5 tickets every 2.5 hours generates a similar return to participation in the daily over the long term.
I do wonder however if cash rewards are the best motivator to get people playing the club events. Having good packs at the end of each week or something might be a better motivator to bring people in. 5x ceramics or a carbon or garage slots would be more motivating to me than any cash reward.
If not weekly perhaps top tier prizes could be unlocked by club achievements. Every 100 MVP awards you get 25 garage slots. Every 25 top 10 finishes earns a Ceramic pack. 100 platinum for participation? Have a CF. 500 events with at least 5 races run? ceramic + slots. The constant ticking over of good rewards (some behind a significant grind) would really drag people in IMHO.
I don't discount the possibility that this is just resistance to change, but I really struggle with why the introduction of clubs (compelling concept, very welcome, needs work) means the end of the daily? I don't see the cost to the player base or indeed to hutch of continuing to run the dalies.
If there's real mileage in a certain threshold of rewards being important, we definitely want to get there. Not necessarily through Club Events. It could be through Challenges or regular Events.
Remember, I'm not out to reduce daily income. And a lot of these income concerns are about income for the non-time rich, the top (top 10% maybe) of 150RQ players. That's the main issue to solve.
You know I'm very concerned about the ongoing struggles of the freshly minted 150RQ group, so we have the same concern there, too.
If we can solve the issues both parties have (you guys wanting strong cash income), my concerns (wanting effort in keeping with the spirit of the game to translate to success, rather than smurfing strategies), then we all win. We've talked about moves towards higher end of event prizes and lower prize boards in the past, but haven't implemented any of that. We will be monitoring actual cash earned from Club Events, but let's open up the discussion about other reward structures, maybe in a separate thread.
Yeah, the resistance to change is constant. People doomsay every update we release. I still want to get to the heart of our concerns, because we all want the same thing.
The other factor I hadn't catered for is the loss of D/E food. Obviously most are sold which helps raise the funds from smurfing. However, that option is there to use those as food.
With no dailies and no prize boards on clubs the only food will now come from other event prize boards. If you're trying for T1 in those and getting 1 card per race lower RQ food is going to be difficult.
It gets even worse next time there is a release of new cars. Those D/E/F cars could be rarer than C cars to get.
@Hutch_Robin do what you want. You know better what's good for us. Crews are **** as expected so no dissappointed here but taking daily away for many players will kill game play.I'm not talking of myself because I lost interest with dailys and challanges already.Ooo and Style icon don't look good for me too...other players said event is stupid so I will skip it too BUUU BUUU BUUU
Hutch folks, I'm totally against your ending of dailies.
Smurfing dailies was fantastic for a time-strapped working adult like myself who doesn't have the luxury of playing every 15 minutes. With dailies I could catch a toilet break every 2.5 hours and burn 5 tickets in 3 minutes. There's no way I'm making the same bank in the same time with club events.
Also, I have spent a couple hundred dollars in TD and have not gotten a single S tier after about 160 Ceramics and 40+ CF. The free players have wisely smurfed to be able to open many more Ceramics and have gotten their S tiers. Now you're telling me that I can never catch up to that despite having at least paid some good dollars?
I'm not on board. Hey, if you want to add content to the game, by all means that's great. If you want to give the time-rich players something to do, by all means that's great. But to take away an option that has well served a (seemingly) large portion of your player base? Why would you do that? Why not leave dailies and let the guys with nothing better to do play clubs?
very nice... the dailies need only a refresh every week about track sets, we see every week and every same day the sam track set!!
You kill f2p and casual players with this club... if i work or if someone study or live... he cannot play all day long this game for clubs wheer i don't have a stupid prize table... i cannot find some D or E cars to upgrade my garage (C, D and E) and not earn gold or money for buying ceramics or CF... you kill your game!! Good work...
If you're getting rid of dailies why not just add another event that is only 24hrs that has different random requirements every day similar to how the requirements rotate for clubs. The prize structure can be the same as the dailies was before and it'll give people some excitement for a short event that they could actually do well in if the requirement suits them that day. Not just a buggati fest like the dailies were. And if your garage happens to suck that day for whatever requirement it is then you can choose to smurf it. Sounds like a simple solution to make all parties happy.
rewards are nowhere near the same for the equivalent playing time..... Dailies you could easily clear 4 boards ( lose 5 races at 22:00 & 07:00 then Win 20 races from next 20-25 tickets) netting £33000 (will be higher because of the tier prize)
each board:-
4 rare cards @ £1k each = £4000
1 uncommon = £250
8 cash prizes @ £500 each = £4000
Total £8500 per board
Also 10 gold per board = 40 gold a day
7 days at £330000 = £231,000
so if we play the same 30-35 times what is the best we could achieve with clubs:
enter event and play 5 races, pointless playing more as prize per race drops, do this 6 or at most 7 times
participation 5 races = £500
performance silver = £500
Rank rookie = £200
Total £1200 per event = £8400 for 7 events (35 races, same amount as daily races now)
lets say you win 5 events to 2 losses that's another £3200
daily total = £11600
weekly total = £81200
Add season awards
At Best £7500 if team wins
49 events played during 7 days = £7500
Performance if lucky top 10 = £5000
Rank Rookie £1000
Total weekly cash prize = £102,200
so each week playing the same amount of races players will lose £129,000
Hutch, you really need to look at the prize structure so playing the equivalent of 7 full sets of tickets ie 35 races nets the same kind of rewards.....current proposed Club 2 prize structure is a joke where by you get less than half the current level of the daily prize boards
In short, I have read all the comments of this thread and the internal thread of the game too, and all the players are asking that "please, don't die the daily events", your team still thinks that the best option is don't listen to the community.
@Hutch_Robin Please please please don't get rid of the dailies. At least not without thinking very seriously about their impact and the prizes for club participation.
Cash is BEYOND important to F2P. Consistent, reliable cash generation is the only reason F2P is viable.
Even a freshly minted rq150 player can smurf effectively and make significant funds from the dailies.
The numbers above suggest that even the best players with the widest garages will see revenue from dailies halved by their replacement with club events. Someone with a thin garage will see their earning potential drop significantly further.
Anything that compromises the ability to earn cash compromises the ability of f2p players to compete, the three ceramics a day I can open are the source of the bulk of epics, legends and food for the same that I've been able to muster in 18 months of play.
For newer players they are even more critical.
The dailies are also an interesting exercise in revenue maximising, less like a competition, more like a puzzle, no less interesting because of that and no worse for having a repeatable "solution".
I'd be content enough of they changed once a quarter, but honestly you could leave them alone for the life of the game and that would be fine by me.
If you insist on getting rid of the dalies then I suggest you need to double the number of regular events running or dramatically increase the club rewards either with packs or cash so 5 tickets every 2.5 hours generates a similar return to participation in the daily over the long term.
I do wonder however if cash rewards are the best motivator to get people playing the club events. Having good packs at the end of each week or something might be a better motivator to bring people in. 5x ceramics or a carbon or garage slots would be more motivating to me than any cash reward.
If not weekly perhaps top tier prizes could be unlocked by club achievements. Every 100 MVP awards you get 25 garage slots. Every 25 top 10 finishes earns a Ceramic pack. 100 platinum for participation? Have a CF. 500 events with at least 5 races run? ceramic + slots. The constant ticking over of good rewards (some behind a significant grind) would really drag people in IMHO.
I don't discount the possibility that this is just resistance to change, but I really struggle with why the introduction of clubs (compelling concept, very welcome, needs work) means the end of the daily? I don't see the cost to the player base or indeed to hutch of continuing to run the dalies.
If there's real mileage in a certain threshold of rewards being important, we definitely want to get there. Not necessarily through Club Events. It could be through Challenges or regular Events.
Remember, I'm not out to reduce daily income. And a lot of these income concerns are about income for the non-time rich, the top (top 10% maybe) of 150RQ players. That's the main issue to solve.
You know I'm very concerned about the ongoing struggles of the freshly minted 150RQ group, so we have the same concern there, too.
If we can solve the issues both parties have (you guys wanting strong cash income), my concerns (wanting effort in keeping with the spirit of the game to translate to success, rather than smurfing strategies), then we all win. We've talked about moves towards higher end of event prizes and lower prize boards in the past, but haven't implemented any of that. We will be monitoring actual cash earned from Club Events, but let's open up the discussion about other reward structures, maybe in a separate thread.
Yeah, the resistance to change is constant. People doomsay every update we release. I still want to get to the heart of our concerns, because we all want the same thing.
With respect Robin (and for once I actually mean that) reducing player income might not be your goal, buys it's absolutely going to be the consequence of this choice. The numbers from drizzt above make that pretty clear.
A holistic review of prizes is all well and good (and welcome) but in the let's say 2-3 months that review and implementation will take how many fresh 150's are going to look at how the packs they can open (it sure as hell isn't going to be the current 20+ a week) and decide that they just can't compete any more. How many mature f2p players are going to say "sod it" and quit? The cohort they're replaced by won't be able to make good content for the whales who pay your bills because they won't be able to open the packs to be able to mount any sort of challenge, and when your whales get bored they flame out. Complete and total domination gets boring PDQ.
If you want to look at prize structure that's brilliant, but dropping our earning potential in meantime seems a bad way to manage the process.
Regular requests on the forums for farming strategies are there because people need that cash they generate in order to compete and be content for other players.
I'd also echo the comments above re new content. Without being able to farm and save significant cash f2p ability to compete in new content is gone. Not damaged, GONE.
In short, I have read all the comments of this thread and the internal thread of the game too, and all the players are asking that "please, don't die the daily events", your team still thinks that the best option is don't listen to the community.
I'm sorry, but I don't understand it, why?
Hutch are always claiming to want the best for the player and at the start (2 years ago) they did listen on the forum but since then it’s all been about the money and they haven’t thought twice about the players. To gain more money hutch you do realise you need happy players? It’s a fine balance that at the minute is no where near. The best feedback is customer feedback and the customer is (nearly) always right. You were onto something good with this game, don’t kill it for us all please
Dailies are gone, the decision was made. Long time players can advise all they want. Much like anything else i have seen since September 2017, the players believe the game can improve one way and Hutch takes a difference course. I countered every point Robin said about the reasoning behind removing the dailies. And for Robin to say "Yeah, the resistance to change is constant" says a lot about how yours and my opinion matters.
Comments
Just a quick look at Blue2moro's numbers. I'll propose a few corrections, perhaps there are more.
- 224k a week is assuming 7 fewer events, but there are only 6 fewer events due to an additional Thursday event, so that's 192k difference. Tier 4 of a 48h event rewards 2.5k extra cash more than Tier 4 of a 24h event, so lets say 189.5k cash.
- If you assume at least Rookie rank, as it takes just two days to get to, that adds $1.5k (1k event, 0.5k season)
- Spend 499 gold on the doubler, and you're at -59 gold, but up 129.5k.
There may be more maths we can do, and we'll keep an eye on the actual earnings, but then we're talking about 259k a week. That's +35k and -59 gold. Much closer than it sounded with the example you gave.
I understand a lot of your objections, but come on. There is more variety in Club Events than Dailies.
I've spoken about this before.
Totally missed that. I don't read the forum every day.
Here are ten of our reasons:
- Players wanted more ways to play Top Drives, rather than the limited ticket system. Club Events especially serves time rich players.
Some players voiced that in the past, yes. Not by removing the daily events. Club events does indeed serve the time rich players, not the time poor players, the ones with jobs, school etc. The daily serves the time limited players. So, are you focusing on the time rich players?
- Players wanted shorter, quickfire events
Indeed, but as an addition to the current structure and not with the removal of daily events.
- Players wanted more variety in events, in terms of track sets and restrictions, and we needed a way to scale this. Similarly, players just wanted to use more of their garages. Players complained about the lack of variety (and other issues) in Daily Events a lot.
You are right that people complained about the variety. And the solution could have been more variety in the daily events and not the same events every week. Players voiced that over and over again for months. The complains were about that, not that they wanted the removal of the daily events.
- Players liked the idea of choice in which events they joined. It potentially allows players to specialise their garage more effectively.
Players can decide to enter the daily or not. More variety in daily events will allow players to use their garage more effectively.
- Daily Events were not just too similar but players played against the same players so often. We wanted to try a social feature where lots of different players could encounter one another outside of the forums.
I play with the same players in regular events all the time. I have seen the same people in my bracket winning prize cars week after week. Are you removing those also? Not sure what this has to do with daily events unless you are talking about all events. The social aspect is great, as an addition and only as that. If i don't want to socialize, you are leaving me with no choice but to do so?
- The losing to win farming strategy was not particular fun, but felt necessary. Ultimately, it wasn't good for the game
It was great for the game. Ask anyone who farmed and got ceramics. And if someone didn't like it, they had the choice of not entering.
- We wanted to find a way to introduce less timezone sensitive events
Perfect. Good for the club events, why was the daily event removed? The rest of the events will still be time sensitive right?
- I had seen the territory mechanic in other games and it was compelling
There are a lot of other compelling mechanics in other games. Daily events got removed because other games have different mechanics?
- We observed players enjoying working together in events, and wanted to introduce light cooperation in events so that that experience was available to more users
We love having virtual friends, Myspace has the idea first i think and Facebook stole it. The reason players coop is because of the great prizes. Daily events could become coop too. If the prizes were better. I'm not going to coop to win that great aluminium pack.
- We wanted to introduce something fresh. Perhaps a trial for player created clubs in the future. Players had also requested us doing something in the club space. This was a way to have a simple implementation of clubs, without too much infrastructure around setting up and maintaining a club, allowing us to focus on a twist on the standard event gameplay. Club Events is also a new framework to build on.
Fresh is good, and club events are ok. Good thoughts on how the clubs can become better over time. Also don't fix it until is broken is also good thing.
The reasons you provided give absolutely no indication in my mind that daily events weren't working.
If you want to call it top 10 reasons why we are introducing Club events, i'm with you. Just don't call it 10 reasons why you are removing daily events.
Daily events can and should stay. Ultimately, it is up to the player to enter the daily or not. Players have a choice.
Cash is BEYOND important to F2P. Consistent, reliable cash generation is the only reason F2P is viable.
Even a freshly minted rq150 player can smurf effectively and make significant funds from the dailies.
The numbers above suggest that even the best players with the widest garages will see revenue from dailies halved by their replacement with club events. Someone with a thin garage will see their earning potential drop significantly further.
Anything that compromises the ability to earn cash compromises the ability of f2p players to compete, the three ceramics a day I can open are the source of the bulk of epics, legends and food for the same that I've been able to muster in 18 months of play.
For newer players they are even more critical.
The dailies are also an interesting exercise in revenue maximising, less like a competition, more like a puzzle, no less interesting because of that and no worse for having a repeatable "solution".
I'd be content enough of they changed once a quarter, but honestly you could leave them alone for the life of the game and that would be fine by me.
If you insist on getting rid of the dalies then I suggest you need to double the number of regular events running or dramatically increase the club rewards either with packs or cash so 5 tickets every 2.5 hours generates a similar return to participation in the daily over the long term.
I do wonder however if cash rewards are the best motivator to get people playing the club events. Having good packs at the end of each week or something might be a better motivator to bring people in. 5x ceramics or a carbon or garage slots would be more motivating to me than any cash reward.
If not weekly perhaps top tier prizes could be unlocked by club achievements. Every 100 MVP awards you get 25 garage slots. Every 25 top 10 finishes earns a Ceramic pack. 100 platinum for participation? Have a CF. 500 events with at least 5 races run? ceramic + slots. The constant ticking over of good rewards (some behind a significant grind) would really drag people in IMHO.
I don't discount the possibility that this is just resistance to change, but I really struggle with why the introduction of clubs (compelling concept, very welcome, needs work) means the end of the daily? I don't see the cost to the player base or indeed to hutch of continuing to run the dalies.
They say don't fix something that's not broken, but you are taking the daily away because the lowest part of f2p aren't satisfied with the usual players always winning it? Well, who do you think will ever spend 499 gold on a doubler? Certainly not the no spending players, and let's be frank, nobody unless somebody with super fat finger to click it twice by mistake.
You know what they really want? To have the trophy count taken away or the trophy deficit to be back so they feel free to smurf, which you could counter by setting a barometer on each person's garage strength, but that's past, and what's people complaining isn't what the club is resolving.
Sorry to say but the long waited club has turned out to be a very big disappointment for the long term players, I don't even know how it stands as the idea, when you could just have taken even a little inspiration from other games with group play, like super cell's games, or animation throwndown (Kongregate) who makes a lot of profit with their card game by setting "guilds" to fight one another, to compete with a specific set of collection each week. Instead you use this territory thing with seasons, why? What benefit does it bring you? Does it sell more packs for you?
I don't care if you take this comment down because you don't like my opinion, but I have to spill it since I've witnessed this game "falling" in such short time (2 years life is not long). Hope you don't have to eat your own words from the results that you are going to see later.
Remember, I'm not out to reduce daily income. And a lot of these income concerns are about income for the non-time rich, the top (top 10% maybe) of 150RQ players. That's the main issue to solve.
You know I'm very concerned about the ongoing struggles of the freshly minted 150RQ group, so we have the same concern there, too.
If we can solve the issues both parties have (you guys wanting strong cash income), my concerns (wanting effort in keeping with the spirit of the game to translate to success, rather than smurfing strategies), then we all win. We've talked about moves towards higher end of event prizes and lower prize boards in the past, but haven't implemented any of that. We will be monitoring actual cash earned from Club Events, but let's open up the discussion about other reward structures, maybe in a separate thread.
Yeah, the resistance to change is constant. People doomsay every update we release. I still want to get to the heart of our concerns, because we all want the same thing.
With no dailies and no prize boards on clubs the only food will now come from other event prize boards. If you're trying for T1 in those and getting 1 card per race lower RQ food is going to be difficult.
It gets even worse next time there is a release of new cars. Those D/E/F cars could be rarer than C cars to get.
You know better what's good for us.
Crews are **** as expected so no dissappointed here but taking daily away for many players will kill game play.I'm not talking of myself because I lost interest with dailys and challanges already.Ooo and Style icon don't look good for me too...other players said event is stupid so I will skip it too
BUUU BUUU BUUU
Smurfing dailies was fantastic for a time-strapped working adult like myself who doesn't have the luxury of playing every 15 minutes. With dailies I could catch a toilet break every 2.5 hours and burn 5 tickets in 3 minutes. There's no way I'm making the same bank in the same time with club events.
Also, I have spent a couple hundred dollars in TD and have not gotten a single S tier after about 160 Ceramics and 40+ CF. The free players have wisely smurfed to be able to open many more Ceramics and have gotten their S tiers. Now you're telling me that I can never catch up to that despite having at least paid some good dollars?
I'm not on board. Hey, if you want to add content to the game, by all means that's great. If you want to give the time-rich players something to do, by all means that's great. But to take away an option that has well served a (seemingly) large portion of your player base? Why would you do that? Why not leave dailies and let the guys with nothing better to do play clubs?
This is illogical, Hutch. Very very illogical.
rewards are nowhere near the same for the equivalent playing time..... Dailies you could easily clear 4 boards ( lose 5 races at 22:00 & 07:00 then Win 20 races from next 20-25 tickets) netting £33000 (will be higher because of the tier prize)
each board:-
4 rare cards @ £1k each = £4000
1 uncommon = £250
8 cash prizes @ £500 each = £4000
Total £8500 per board
Also 10 gold per board = 40 gold a day
7 days at £330000 = £231,000
so if we play the same 30-35 times what is the best we could achieve with clubs:
enter event and play 5 races, pointless playing more as prize per race drops, do this 6 or at most 7 times
participation 5 races = £500
performance silver = £500
Rank rookie = £200
Total £1200 per event = £8400 for 7 events (35 races, same amount as daily races now)
lets say you win 5 events to 2 losses that's another £3200
daily total = £11600
weekly total = £81200
Add season awards
At Best £7500 if team wins
49 events played during 7 days = £7500
Performance if lucky top 10 = £5000
Rank Rookie £1000
Total weekly cash prize = £102,200
so each week playing the same amount of races players will lose £129,000
Hutch, you really need to look at the prize structure so playing the equivalent of 7 full sets of tickets ie 35 races nets the same kind of rewards.....current proposed Club 2 prize structure is a joke where by you get less than half the current level of the daily prize boards
is worth measly 7500 cash and 100 gold??
I'm sorry, but I don't understand it, why?
A holistic review of prizes is all well and good (and welcome) but in the let's say 2-3 months that review and implementation will take how many fresh 150's are going to look at how the packs they can open (it sure as hell isn't going to be the current 20+ a week) and decide that they just can't compete any more. How many mature f2p players are going to say "sod it" and quit? The cohort they're replaced by won't be able to make good content for the whales who pay your bills because they won't be able to open the packs to be able to mount any sort of challenge, and when your whales get bored they flame out. Complete and total domination gets boring PDQ.
If you want to look at prize structure that's brilliant, but dropping our earning potential in meantime seems a bad way to manage the process.
Regular requests on the forums for farming strategies are there because people need that cash they generate in order to compete and be content for other players.
I'd also echo the comments above re new content. Without being able to farm and save significant cash f2p ability to compete in new content is gone. Not damaged, GONE.
It took me 5m and 5000g (I got lucky with my CFs) igc to get a decent FR hand, if revenue is halved which seems a reasonable **** packet calculation, the next content drop is going to be a real ordeal for f2p. I'm thinking along the lines of the suggestions here: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/bttoqk/youre_allowed_to_carry_one_handheld_item_into_a/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app
And for Robin to say "Yeah, the resistance to change is constant" says a lot about how yours and my opinion matters.
RIP Top Drives, a great idea killed by the obsession of money. 😔