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Time Travel pack

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  • O__VERO__VER ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 1,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    TopDives said:
    What?!? Is this a mistake? This can't be right. @Hutch_Katie @Hutch_Tim
    It's not a mistake. Otherwise they would have changed it when they changed the TBT event.
  • OzzmanOzzman ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 1,248 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Back when it was a login gift they said "it's like a double premium pack". Meaning it will give you at least two SR cars. So, you know, two SRs -> double price. I wonder how it'll sell. With the slightly misleading caption probably well.
  • MrpiratepeteMrpiratepete ✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 368 ✭✭✭✭
    Ozzman said:
    Back when it was a login gift they said "it's like a double premium pack". Meaning it will give you at least two SR cars. So, you know, two SRs -> double price. I wonder how it'll sell. With the slightly misleading caption probably well.
    Idiots like me will buy it, so it will probably sell well.
    But this whole mess is just adding more gasoline to the fire and I honestly don't know how much they can take anymore...
  • bertmcfishbertmcfish ✭✭✭ Member Posts: 159 ✭✭✭
    If I want to offer with new pack formats, I should get better keeping people informed as to the odds. Very sorry if it seemed unclear - I really think being transparent with odds is a key part of TD. I just made a tool this morning that creates player friendly version of the odds quicker than before. Will also look at making localisation clearer.

    So yes, it's like a double premium pack - but it doesn't guarantee two Super Rare, because then we can't give good odds of a Super Rare in each decade. I like the idea of having different kinds of packs, especially between Ceramic and Carbon Fibers, but there's often not really a good way to do it without it seeming like a proto-Carbon Fiber, so in this pack, you receive a car from each decade and the odds are spread between them.



    A quick comparison between a 90s pack and the Time Travel pack. At full price, it's 67% more expensive, with 90% more Legendaries, 55% more Epics, 37% more Ultra Rares, 96% more Super Rares, 156% more Rares, and 2.7 fewer Uncommons. So, pound-for-pound, it's a higher Legendary drop rate, slightly weaker Epic and Ultra Rare rates, higher Super Rare rate, and you get a card from each decade.


    @Hutch_Robin , please earn some goodwill and refund players. Put your hands up, admit the ambiguity and move on
  • MrpiratepeteMrpiratepete ✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 368 ✭✭✭✭
    If I want to offer with new pack formats, I should get better keeping people informed as to the odds. Very sorry if it seemed unclear - I really think being transparent with odds is a key part of TD. I just made a tool this morning that creates player friendly version of the odds quicker than before. Will also look at making localisation clearer.

    So yes, it's like a double premium pack - but it doesn't guarantee two Super Rare, because then we can't give good odds of a Super Rare in each decade. I like the idea of having different kinds of packs, especially between Ceramic and Carbon Fibers, but there's often not really a good way to do it without it seeming like a proto-Carbon Fiber, so in this pack, you receive a car from each decade and the odds are spread between them.



    A quick comparison between a 90s pack and the Time Travel pack. At full price, it's 67% more expensive, with 90% more Legendaries, 55% more Epics, 37% more Ultra Rares, 96% more Super Rares, 156% more Rares, and 2.7 fewer Uncommons. So, pound-for-pound, it's a higher Legendary drop rate, slightly weaker Epic and Ultra Rare rates, higher Super Rare rate, and you get a card from each decade.


    Thanks for the clarification, sadly it's a little bit too late. If I had known the odds I wouldn't have bought the pack.
    I just trusted the word of mouth in the IGF and combined with the missleading description made a shot for it.
    @Hutch_Robin Any possibilty of a refund or compensation of any kind?
  • RuvlaRuvla Member Posts: 47
    So the price is more than 2 times higher than ceramic, but chances are less than 2 times higher.

    Why have I bought this ****?

    Another thing I am wondering, is where (client or server) chances are calculated and what function is being used. I hope function is individual per player sequence, but not common shared to the whole server.


  • RWareRWare ✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 650 ✭✭✭✭
    0.1%

    I mean...what's the point?
  • MrpiratepeteMrpiratepete ✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 368 ✭✭✭✭
    ...with 90% more Legendaries...So, pound-for-pound, it's a higher Legendary drop rate...
    Thats a nice wording for a 0,65% chance of dropping a legendary...
  • bertmcfishbertmcfish ✭✭✭ Member Posts: 159 ✭✭✭
    All you are doing now is seriously annoying your customers. More and more nonsense form the support staff. You have admitted it was misleading and ambiguous, just refund those who aren’t happy!
  • bantel_catbantel_cat ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 839 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Come on guys... buy, buy, buy

    If between us we can buy approximately 153 Billion Packs, one lucky person should have 4 Legendaries to show for it... it could be you!
  • TGPDTGPD ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 5,364 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 12
    @Hutch_Robin If you really want to make this week vaguely feel like an anniversary this pack should be 599G at most...
  • REALAISREALAIS ✭✭✭ Member Posts: 186 ✭✭✭
    Come on guys... buy, buy, buy

    If between us we can buy approximately 153 Billion Packs, one lucky person should have 4 Legendaries to show for it... it could be you!
    From where are you getting 153 billions packs? Its 0.1% for 4th card to be legendary.
  • 0171801718 ✭✭✭ Member Posts: 101 ✭✭✭
    First of all, I found the description misleading, too.. I was pretty sure that there would be no increased chance for SR cars and that the prize was either an odd mistake or that Hutch thought it would be a good idea to sell the "time" element for a ridiculous amount of gold. I most certainly did not think the pack would contain 4 guaranteed SR cars. That would be ridiculous too, because you get a guaranteed SR for 500 gold usually. What I don't understand is why anyone would buy a pack, if the description appears to be ambiguous.

    What I consider really important is the last table given by Robin. It displays the expected value as a sum of 5 single events. Is it really that simple??? I always thought that the rarity of a card n+1 is at least as high as the card n. Given that, if the first card you pull is a SR (35%), all other cards should be super rare or higher. I really wonder if the expectancy values given in the tables are correct. Maybe someone could shed some light onto this question, as the interdependence of card pulls really confuses me.

    @Hutch_Robin I found the idea, that you can tap a pack just like you can tap a car and see its details really good!

  • Blue2moroBlue2moro ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 1,744 ✭✭✭✭✭
    01718 said:
    First of all, I found the description misleading, too.. I was pretty sure that there would be no increased chance for SR cars and that the prize was either an odd mistake or that Hutch thought it would be a good idea to sell the "time" element for a ridiculous amount of gold. I most certainly did not think the pack would contain 4 guaranteed SR cars. That would be ridiculous too, because you get a guaranteed SR for 500 gold usually. What I don't understand is why anyone would buy a pack, if the description appears to be ambiguous.

    What I consider really important is the last table given by Robin. It displays the expected value as a sum of 5 single events. Is it really that simple??? I always thought that the rarity of a card n+1 is at least as high as the card n. Given that, if the first card you pull is a SR (35%), all other cards should be super rare or higher. I really wonder if the expectancy values given in the tables are correct. Maybe someone could shed some light onto this question, as the interdependence of card pulls really confuses me.

    @Hutch_Robin I found the idea, that you can tap a pack just like you can tap a car and see its details really good!

    When opening the pack each card is identified by the game, then when you turn them over they are sorted in RQ order for you. So if card 1 was an epic and card 2 was a legendary (yeah, yeah, I know, unlikely) then when turning over you would see the epic before the legendary, despite it being your number 1 card pick in the pack.  Does that make sense?
  • MrpiratepeteMrpiratepete ✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 368 ✭✭✭✭
    Blue2moro said:
    01718 said:
    First of all, I found the description misleading, too.. I was pretty sure that there would be no increased chance for SR cars and that the prize was either an odd mistake or that Hutch thought it would be a good idea to sell the "time" element for a ridiculous amount of gold. I most certainly did not think the pack would contain 4 guaranteed SR cars. That would be ridiculous too, because you get a guaranteed SR for 500 gold usually. What I don't understand is why anyone would buy a pack, if the description appears to be ambiguous.

    What I consider really important is the last table given by Robin. It displays the expected value as a sum of 5 single events. Is it really that simple??? I always thought that the rarity of a card n+1 is at least as high as the card n. Given that, if the first card you pull is a SR (35%), all other cards should be super rare or higher. I really wonder if the expectancy values given in the tables are correct. Maybe someone could shed some light onto this question, as the interdependence of card pulls really confuses me.

    @Hutch_Robin I found the idea, that you can tap a pack just like you can tap a car and see its details really good!

    When opening the pack each card is identified by the game, then when you turn them over they are sorted in RQ order for you. So if card 1 was an epic and card 2 was a legendary (yeah, yeah, I know, unlikely) then when turning over you would see the epic before the legendary, despite it being your number 1 card pick in the pack.  Does that make sense?
    Yes.
    But this makes it even less transparent? Because you don't know which card gave you which rarity.
  • 0171801718 ✭✭✭ Member Posts: 101 ✭✭✭
    Blue2moro said:
    01718 said:

    What I consider really important is the last table given by Robin. It displays the expected value as a sum of 5 single events. Is it really that simple??? I always thought that the rarity of a card n+1 is at least as high as the card n. Given that, if the first card you pull is a SR (35%), all other cards should be super rare or higher. I really wonder if the expectancy values given in the tables are correct. Maybe someone could shed some light onto this question, as the interdependence of card pulls really confuses me.

    @Hutch_Robin I found the idea, that you can tap a pack just like you can tap a car and see its details really good!

    When opening the pack each card is identified by the game, then when you turn them over they are sorted in RQ order for you. So if card 1 was an epic and card 2 was a legendary (yeah, yeah, I know, unlikely) then when turning over you would see the epic before the legendary, despite it being your number 1 card pick in the pack.  Does that make sense?
    So cards are drawn independently and just sorted by the game to give us a climatic user experience.

    Totally makes sense, thank you!

  • Blue2moroBlue2moro ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 1,744 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Blue2moro said:
    01718 said:
    First of all, I found the description misleading, too.. I was pretty sure that there would be no increased chance for SR cars and that the prize was either an odd mistake or that Hutch thought it would be a good idea to sell the "time" element for a ridiculous amount of gold. I most certainly did not think the pack would contain 4 guaranteed SR cars. That would be ridiculous too, because you get a guaranteed SR for 500 gold usually. What I don't understand is why anyone would buy a pack, if the description appears to be ambiguous.

    What I consider really important is the last table given by Robin. It displays the expected value as a sum of 5 single events. Is it really that simple??? I always thought that the rarity of a card n+1 is at least as high as the card n. Given that, if the first card you pull is a SR (35%), all other cards should be super rare or higher. I really wonder if the expectancy values given in the tables are correct. Maybe someone could shed some light onto this question, as the interdependence of card pulls really confuses me.

    @Hutch_Robin I found the idea, that you can tap a pack just like you can tap a car and see its details really good!

    When opening the pack each card is identified by the game, then when you turn them over they are sorted in RQ order for you. So if card 1 was an epic and card 2 was a legendary (yeah, yeah, I know, unlikely) then when turning over you would see the epic before the legendary, despite it being your number 1 card pick in the pack.  Does that make sense?
    Yes.
    But this makes it even less transparent? Because you don't know which card gave you which rarity.
    Normally, no, but in this packs case each card except card 1 is from a specific decade so you could work out 4 of them.  Obviously card 1 could be from any of the decades.

    Basically that 0.1% chance of a legendary for card 4 is a guaranteed 917 (only 70s legendary).  Card 3's 0.1% chance at legendary becomes a 50/50 chance between the awesome 962C and the absolute dog **** 959.
  • bertmcfishbertmcfish ✭✭✭ Member Posts: 159 ✭✭✭
    SSV said:
    I wouldn’t buy it if it was 599 gold...
    I wouldn’t have bought it for any gold if it had been clear what it was! I’d stopped spending anyway, but this is the final nail in the coffin. Why even advertise these ‘deals’ to 150rq players? They are of no interest. You’d have to be daft to buy premium/ceramic with gold. I have a weak 70s and 90s hand so thought 4xSR would be useful. Totally misleading and false advertising. No wonder the uk government are looking into games like this
  • MrpiratepeteMrpiratepete ✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 368 ✭✭✭✭

    Aaaand we got a winner... 🤷‍♂️
    (IGF on Pc is as bad as in the app)
  • bantel_catbantel_cat ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 839 ✭✭✭✭✭
    REALAIS said:
    Come on guys... buy, buy, buy

    If between us we can buy approximately 153 Billion Packs, one lucky person should have 4 Legendaries to show for it... it could be you!
    From where are you getting 153 billions packs? Its 0.1% for 4th card to be legendary.
    That is the 'odds' of getting 4xS in the same pack.

    In the 4th card it is 0.1% or 1 in a 1000, i.e you could expect to open 1000 packs and get 1 S on card 4.
    To also get an S on card 3 is 0.1%, so to get an S on both cards it is 0.1% x 0.1%= 1 in a Million, i.e for that one pack draw that you were lucky enough to get an S on card 4, you only have a 1 in 1000 chance of also getting an S on Card 3, therefore you need 1000 instances of having an S on Card 4 to 'expect' one on card 3 as well, hence the multiplication.
    Add card 2 at 0.1% and it is 1 in a Billion
    Then add Card 1 at 0.65% and it is 1 in 153 Billion chance of getting an S on each of the 4 cards
  • REALAISREALAIS ✭✭✭ Member Posts: 186 ✭✭✭
    REALAIS said:
    Come on guys... buy, buy, buy

    If between us we can buy approximately 153 Billion Packs, one lucky person should have 4 Legendaries to show for it... it could be you!
    From where are you getting 153 billions packs? Its 0.1% for 4th card to be legendary.
    That is the 'odds' of getting 4xS in the same pack.

    In the 4th card it is 0.1% or 1 in a 1000, i.e you could expect to open 1000 packs and get 1 S on card 4.
    To also get an S on card 3 is 0.1%, so to get an S on both cards it is 0.1% x 0.1%= 1 in a Million, i.e for that one pack draw that you were lucky enough to get an S on card 4, you only have a 1 in 1000 chance of also getting an S on Card 3, therefore you need 1000 instances of having an S on Card 4 to 'expect' one on card 3 as well, hence the multiplication.
    Add card 2 at 0.1% and it is 1 in a Billion
    Then add Card 1 at 0.65% and it is 1 in 153 Billion chance of getting an S on each of the 4 cards
    Yeah, I got that now, maybe. Each card is pulled independently no matter of other cards pulled before?
  • bantel_catbantel_cat ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 839 ✭✭✭✭✭
    REALAIS said:
    REALAIS said:
    Come on guys... buy, buy, buy

    If between us we can buy approximately 153 Billion Packs, one lucky person should have 4 Legendaries to show for it... it could be you!
    From where are you getting 153 billions packs? Its 0.1% for 4th card to be legendary.
    That is the 'odds' of getting 4xS in the same pack.

    In the 4th card it is 0.1% or 1 in a 1000, i.e you could expect to open 1000 packs and get 1 S on card 4.
    To also get an S on card 3 is 0.1%, so to get an S on both cards it is 0.1% x 0.1%= 1 in a Million, i.e for that one pack draw that you were lucky enough to get an S on card 4, you only have a 1 in 1000 chance of also getting an S on Card 3, therefore you need 1000 instances of having an S on Card 4 to 'expect' one on card 3 as well, hence the multiplication.
    Add card 2 at 0.1% and it is 1 in a Billion
    Then add Card 1 at 0.65% and it is 1 in 153 Billion chance of getting an S on each of the 4 cards
    Yeah, I got that now, maybe. Each card is pulled independently no matter of other cards pulled before?
    Yep, in statistical terms, each card flip is an 'independent event' completely unrelated to the other cards in a pack.
  • AndreasSimmerAndreasSimmer ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 815 ✭✭✭✭✭
    So one guy from support replied, just referring to this post and the odds in the help section which they updated today. No word of sorry or refund, what a joke really. Its not the first time THIS guy denies a refund , first time i got 80s cars in a 90s pack and he refused to compensate, some good guy stepped in and found a compromiss.
  • mauro07mauro07 ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 2,331 ✭✭✭✭✭
    we know that in FAQ we can see the odds of packs... but who use FAQ? Can you add and little (i) on the pack and if we click, we can know the odds? it's more clear then the FAQ around the app!!!
  • AndreasSimmerAndreasSimmer ✭✭✭✭✭ Member Posts: 815 ✭✭✭✭✭
    About odds, very interesting to know that each card is pulled indepentely. I always thought good of 10xceramics, because when you pull an B early it will be great. Looks like it isnt that way.
    I also did the math on how much money you need to buy the gold needed to buy the 153b packs, its around 130 million if Hutch gives a little discount on bulk gold.But what to do if you get unlucky and still dont get the perfect pull? credit?
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