A couple ideas for Hutch

RobGripesRobGripes Posts: 2,333 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited May 2018 in General Discussion

I’ve been racking my brain for ideas to solve some of the issues players have been voicing. I will try to address them in this post, my apologies for its length.

Matchmaking

Complaint: being placed in brackets with garages far superior rendering competition to be too difficult.

This is a tough one. A P2W player rightfully should have an advantage, but this doesn’t have to alienate the lesser-spenders. As a F2P I am not in any doubt that I should not win as often as Eric does, so RQ limited events are my bread and butter. When an unlimited RQ event comes out I may just smarf, no problem with that either.

Currently only 2% of a 100 person group wins tier 1, 8% tier 2, 20% tier 3. These numbers are really quite harsh. Maybe something more evenly spread would keep more players interested. 5/10/15% etc. The idea behind this is that Hutch then don't need to adjust the brackets so meticulously, because there is enough chance for everyone.



Asian Event time CRISIS! (Ok, this one really affects me so I CAPS’d it)

Complaint: Asian players have event times starting and ending in the early morning hours, for me it’s 5am.

I would like to have 2 start/end times so that people can choose the playing time that suits them. This is an idea I really want to be implemented. I can never defend my position at the late stage because of the Asian hindrance. This makes me not want to compete from the beginning, I'm simply not interested. I have been grinding for the past month with a view of just farming, rather than competing and that is NOT what this game should be.

If we had staggered catchment areas with alternative start/end times we could see much more variation in the groups of players we are placed with.

For example, if Hong Kong was the west most location of one catchment area, and the East most area of another catchment area, I could be playing with Japanese/Korean players on Monday, and Indian/Middle Eastern players on Tuesday. I won’t see the same players everyday, and I can also not be hindered by my location in terms of competitiveness.

These are the 2 major issues I see with the game and my ideas to solve them.


Post edited by RobGripes on

Comments

  • Bucks73Bucks73 Posts: 608 ✭✭✭✭
    Love the conversation and I actually don’t mind the idea of opening up the percentages of the winning places which is even less in 350 player events. 

    Ill try anything at the moment as it’s getting less fun, even with Eric targeting forum players, me in particular in the Cadillac event. But hey, it’s his gold he’s wasting so good luck to him. 
  • AvengedAvenged Posts: 501 ✭✭✭✭
    @RobGripes Lol I'm also in the "events end at 0500" group. I usually just go for one last push before hitting the sack and then wake up to whatever fortune befell me.
  • benbqbenbq Posts: 590 ✭✭✭✭
    While ago I posted this idea. tl;dr matchmaking should be based on ability to win top prizes, not on quantity of trophies.

    My recommendation is that the matchmaking system needs further, more serious overhaul. Top Drives is an entirely new type of game, really in a lot of ways it is incomparable to other mobile offerings currently. This is extremely cool and revolutionary, but unfortunately Hutch released the game tied to an extremely UN-revolutionary matchmaking system, pulled from dinosaur mobile game ideas like trophy number being an adequate measure of game progression. This is simply ineffective in TD and really in other games, too.

    Here's what happens from a player logic point of view under the current trophy "hard floor" system where we can only gain trophies:

    Step 1: Join event, use one ticket with a burner hand to see what kind of tracks we have.
    Step 2: Look at leaderboard, figure out roughly "Where can I place with the cars that I have vs this opposition."
    Step 3: If the answer to step 2 is "I can place highly enough to gain a prize worthy of gaining trophies," then "TRYHARD MODE ENGAGED." If the answer to step 2 is "My hand isn't really strong enough to make it high enough for worthy prizes," then "Smurf mode engaged again..."

    The flaw under the current trophy system is that for a lot of players, the gap between tryhard mode and smurf mode cannot ever be crossed without a significant wallet punch through the paywall. While for some players this is no problem, this only appeals to a certain segment of people that like to play TD. For casual spenders or f2p, the game quickly loses its shine and people return to spending their dollars on Clash of Clans.

    My proposal is that TD needs a new kind of matchmaking. Here's why: The MAIN JOB of matchmaking is to put people against others of similar strength and ability, making this a game of strategy. Currently, there are two types of garages in TD: Those who have the strength to get the top prize, and those that just don't even come close. TD is now a complex enough animal that it is impossible to measure garage strength by adding up "RQ" in each rarity level, or really almost any other kind of metric since the events can have so many nuances.

    I think we need to introduce a revised player profile, which tracks event participation based on the *type* of trophies the player is receiving. We already receive tiered prizes when a match is over, so I think that the trophies we get should be tiered as well instead of generic # of trophies. I'm fine with keeping the trophy # around as a decoration, but functionally, the matchmaker should separate the tiers of players based on their ability to win tier 1 or tier 2 prizes.

    What this should do in the long run is shake away those who CAN win from those who have no chance. Players who have previously won a tier 1 prize should only be matched against others who have won a tier 1 prize. They should be removed from the pool of "lesser" competing garages. Players who consistently win tier 3 prizes or below, and can never dream of tier 1 could suddenly be matched against each other for the chance at winning some of these insane prize cars, instead of the prize car offerings and other hutch generosities further building the paywall.

    One complaint against this might be that “junior players” can sometimes win cars that more seasoned garages can’t. This might be true once or twice but anyone that wins is automatically matched against other winners, thus automatically adding “seasoning” to the junior garage. 
  • milewski1015milewski1015 Posts: 2,119 ✭✭✭✭✭
    benbq said:
    While ago I posted this idea. tl;dr matchmaking should be based on ability to win top prizes, not on quantity of trophies.

    My recommendation is that the matchmaking system needs further, more serious overhaul. Top Drives is an entirely new type of game, really in a lot of ways it is incomparable to other mobile offerings currently. This is extremely cool and revolutionary, but unfortunately Hutch released the game tied to an extremely UN-revolutionary matchmaking system, pulled from dinosaur mobile game ideas like trophy number being an adequate measure of game progression. This is simply ineffective in TD and really in other games, too.

    Here's what happens from a player logic point of view under the current trophy "hard floor" system where we can only gain trophies:

    Step 1: Join event, use one ticket with a burner hand to see what kind of tracks we have.
    Step 2: Look at leaderboard, figure out roughly "Where can I place with the cars that I have vs this opposition."
    Step 3: If the answer to step 2 is "I can place highly enough to gain a prize worthy of gaining trophies," then "TRYHARD MODE ENGAGED." If the answer to step 2 is "My hand isn't really strong enough to make it high enough for worthy prizes," then "Smurf mode engaged again..."

    The flaw under the current trophy system is that for a lot of players, the gap between tryhard mode and smurf mode cannot ever be crossed without a significant wallet punch through the paywall. While for some players this is no problem, this only appeals to a certain segment of people that like to play TD. For casual spenders or f2p, the game quickly loses its shine and people return to spending their dollars on Clash of Clans.

    My proposal is that TD needs a new kind of matchmaking. Here's why: The MAIN JOB of matchmaking is to put people against others of similar strength and ability, making this a game of strategy. Currently, there are two types of garages in TD: Those who have the strength to get the top prize, and those that just don't even come close. TD is now a complex enough animal that it is impossible to measure garage strength by adding up "RQ" in each rarity level, or really almost any other kind of metric since the events can have so many nuances.

    I think we need to introduce a revised player profile, which tracks event participation based on the *type* of trophies the player is receiving. We already receive tiered prizes when a match is over, so I think that the trophies we get should be tiered as well instead of generic # of trophies. I'm fine with keeping the trophy # around as a decoration, but functionally, the matchmaker should separate the tiers of players based on their ability to win tier 1 or tier 2 prizes.

    What this should do in the long run is shake away those who CAN win from those who have no chance. Players who have previously won a tier 1 prize should only be matched against others who have won a tier 1 prize. They should be removed from the pool of "lesser" competing garages. Players who consistently win tier 3 prizes or below, and can never dream of tier 1 could suddenly be matched against each other for the chance at winning some of these insane prize cars, instead of the prize car offerings and other hutch generosities further building the paywall.

    One complaint against this might be that “junior players” can sometimes win cars that more seasoned garages can’t. This might be true once or twice but anyone that wins is automatically matched against other winners, thus automatically adding “seasoning” to the junior garage.
    I agree, and I believe that a system like what you suggest should be implemented. However, what’s to stop someone with a high end garage from purposely placing low in all events until say, the McLaren P1 finals come around?
  • RobGripesRobGripes Posts: 2,333 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I remember reading your post @benbq

    I think I may have voiced the concern that lesser garages would win prizes that superior garages could not, which I feel is counter intuitive to merit-based gaming.

    I do like how you're coming at this, but I humbly don't really think that is the solution. Also, the trophy system is supposed to do what you are suggesting, separating those who have won loads with those that haven't.

    I think if the brackets were tighter, say in 500 trophy increments we would see better separation.

    The problem is that due to geo-location and server technology, we need to play against players who aren't too far away. There simply may not be enough players to have tighter brackets like that.
  • RobGripesRobGripes Posts: 2,333 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Avenged said:
    @RobGripes Lol I'm also in the "events end at 0500" group. I usually just go for one last push before hitting the sack and then wake up to whatever fortune befell me.
    Yep. Pretty much what I do. Now when i wake up i don't even feel excited to check. I just get it over with lol
  • th1318th1318 Posts: 31
    In the big finals there should be no separation. If I spend money it’s because I want an advantage over people who don’t. I don’t do it to be placed exclusively with other people who spend money. If I lose to someone who spends more than me than that’s ok with me
  • RobGripesRobGripes Posts: 2,333 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Agreed @th1318.

    The good news is that in the big finals there are usually more places for top tier. 8/300 get tier one, which is better than 2/100.

    Hutch already does not create brackets based on RQ, i am guessing trophy scores matter little in the big events.
  • benbqbenbq Posts: 590 ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2018
    Honestly you guys bring up some good points. Either way I doubt hutch will make big changes because this game has already fattened up the company bottom line much more than expected (educated guess). 

    What i I would like to see most of all is some sort of clan/club system where teams could compete against other teams. There could be day-long club vs club challenges where, for example, Individual club members contribute to their club’s pool of available cars. This way each members garage by itself might not be terribly strong but they could still make a few quality contributions to their team’s garage strength.
  • milewski1015milewski1015 Posts: 2,119 ✭✭✭✭✭
    benbq said:
    Honestly you guys bring up some good points. Either way I doubt hutch will make big changes because this game has already fattened up the company bottom line much more than expected (educated guess). 

    What i I would like to see most of all is some sort of clan/club system where teams could compete against other teams. There could be day-long club vs club challenges where, for example, Individual club members contribute to their club’s pool of available cars. This way each members garage by itself might not be terribly strong but they could still make a few quality contributions to their team’s garage strength.
    From back in February (quoting @Hutch_Robin)
    PS - Check out the second from the bottom

    We can’t implement all the ideas for events overnight, but gradually over time, we want to improve events in some of the ways listed below (a list that I’m sure isn’t comprehensive and ranges from small fixes to giant features):

    • Remove Hutch Bots from leaderboards

    • Improve point scoring within events

    • Improve trophy system and event bracket matchmaking

    • Introduce hand criteria (Rainbow; one car from each rarity, 5x French Cars or 5x UK Cars)

    • Introduce synergy points (150% points if you’re playing a Rainbow hand, 150% points if all cars are from the same manufacturer)

    • Have new categories of cars to allow for different kinds of restrictions

    • Have categories based on car stats that can be changed via upgrades (e.g. weight, 0-60 speed)

    • Introduce league tables and seasons

    • Introduce tournaments

    • A greater number of prize tiers in each event

    • New gameplay modes such as a car drafting arena mode

    • Car Clubs and Car Club Events

    • A brand new way to play Top Drives that we haven’t even thought of yet!

  • BugattiBugatti Posts: 3,553 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I still think an easy fix to match making would be...

    Reset everyone to 0
    Only award 1 trophy for Tier 1 rewards
    All other Tier rewards don't gain a trophy.

    Brackets according to trophies as followed...
    0-4
    5-10
    11-20
    21-30
    And so on..
    The better people make their garages the more Tier 1s they will add to trophies and they will advance to next brackets.
    Some people might find a comfy range and decide to stay but they will only be allowed to stay there by not taking any Tier 1 rewards.

    Anyhow.. Just my thought on this matter..
  • mauro07mauro07 Posts: 2,596 ✭✭✭✭✭
    and we need a system of prize for every step of trophy as RQ.... if you win some slots or Carbon, people play for win and take this prizes
  • RobGripesRobGripes Posts: 2,333 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Definitely think prize should improve with RQ increases.

    Also, smurfing with ghost hands is really against what Hutch should be going for. How about, Ghost hands score prize cards as well?

    If someone challenges your ghost hand, and they lose, you get the appropriate number of cards for the score they lost. This gives us incentive to put out our best hands.
  • joel24joel24 Posts: 695 ✭✭✭✭
    maybe removing the limiter of many cars? no? nvm. and also removing the unlimiter of the gt90. Can that car actually go that fast? (ik concept car but still...) I doubt it.
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